There ’s a breed of professional gambler known as reward player . They apply utterly legal method – counting cards , tracking shambling , peeking at the mess cards of sloppy dealers , etc . – to extract wads of money from casinos . And even though they ’re breaking no laws , cassino bosses despise them . Sometimes they treat these reward players – also known as APs – like cheaters . Security guard cuff them , not - so - obscure threat are made , their chips are refused . now and then the APs will even get thrown in jail .
And then they call Bob Nersesian .
free-base in Las Vegas , operating out of a house exchange to an agency , situated in the shadows of shimmer Strip casino , Nersesian , 59 , is the go - to guy for advantage players who retrieve they have been wrong . He ’s taken enceinte casino companies to Margaret Court , stood up to cops and excessively avid security guard , pressed administrator to cash - out winners . While he has no sake in representing trickster , Nersesian , generator of a recently print book entitled The Law for gambler : A Legal Guide to the Casino Environment , stands up for smart as a whip and talented histrion who bring down the theater and sometimes burn it to the ground .
Jason Hoffman/Thrillist
On a sunny good afternoon in September , Nersesian took metre out from defending his big - count client to tell us what bechance when risk taker win too big and casinos get out of ancestry . Here he is , in his own words .
Back in 1996,about five years after my married woman and I moved from Detroit to Las Vegas , I play in a friendly poker game with four other lawyers and a construction guy . We drop more metre drinking beer than spiel lineup and the stakes were something like 25 cent to a dollar . So none of the musician were major gamblers – let in the expression guy who told us about being rough out up by security guards in a casino . They mistake him for an undesirable of some form . He was handcuff , taken into a back - way , and threatened – before they recognise that they had the faulty person .
Hearing his taradiddle , fence whether or not he had a case against this particular casino , the other lawyers said , “ You ’ve got dick . You ca n’t get anything from a casino . ”
Jason Hoffman/Thrillist
I said , “ waitress a minute . We ’re peach talking about false imprisonment and stamp battery here . Once you ’re handcuffed , it becomes assault and battery . ”
What happened to our Quaker did n’t seem ripe and , as thing turned out , it was n’t . He and I process the cassino and we twine up with a five soma settlement . The case never even came closely to going to trial . The lawyers in my game were stunned . They did n’t get it . They said they did n’t call up I could get money out of a casino – especially via resolution . For most plaintiff attorney , settlements are driven by medical expense . My case do n’t have medical expense .
What they do have are people employed by large corporations getting path out of line of reasoning . Even before eccentric involving casinos came across my desk , I knew what wit count was , I make out what advantage gaming was , and , from what I heard , cassino people were insane to suppose they could get aside with handcuffing customers , threatening them , and hang back them into backroom .
Jason Hoffman/Thrillist
I ’ve received oblique scourge from gambling casino executives – one sound out to me , “ You mean you may keep getting away with this ? Your time will come ! ”
I further sustain this after a line - law client of mine – an insurance salesman who card - consider on the side – got manacle and back - roomed at the sometime Maxim casino . He was n’t doing anything illegal – you get amazing upshot when the law is on your side – and Maxim settled with us . It went that way for a while . My name jump to spread . People ground out that I was uncoerced to go up against the casinos and I began getting calls . Into the early 2000s , it was n’t enough to transmute my stage business , or to become a major element of my practice – which center around card dealers , automobile manufacturers , and business litigation – but I found these pillow slip to be interesting . I wish the idea of getting justice for people who had been abused by casinos .
Other people , though , are n’t so crazy about it . I ’ve receive devious terror from cassino executives – one said to me , “ You think you may keep arrive away with this ? Your time will get along ! ” – he was either talking about me losing my license or threatening me with bodily harm – and then there are the local lawyers who conceive that what I do is totally wrong . Their collective attitude is that casinos are the lifeblood of Las Vegas , of our biotic community , and that I should n’t go against them .
Jason Hoffman/Thrillist
Obviously I disaccord with that . In fact , I think I ’m doing a service to Las Vegas . When there are 10 major play destinations in America and 1,000 minor ones , would you go to a property where surety guard duty kick your ass for no cause ? Or to the place where you finger secure play ? I am helping to maintain the latter .
“The casino’s goons beat the sh*t out of him”
I had done no more than 14 of these case when a serial of career changers come up . In 2001 or 2002 , James Grosjean and Michael Russo – two of the smart , sharp advantage - role player in Las Vegas – came into my office . I had never heard of these guys before , but they had an incident at Caesars Palace . James had been in jail for four day and Mike had been held for one daytime . They both posted bail . The gambling casino accused them of card - bending – which is an illegal way of subtly tick off menu – while playing the game of Three Card Poker .
But these hombre were not placard benders . They did a move known as hole carding – where you raven on feeble dealers who are accidentally exposing their golf hole cards . It ’s not illegal , and I watched them doing it on surveillance video . look at the telecasting , you’re able to see exactly what was going on : They were taking reward of the sloppiest dealer you ever saw . Hell , if I was sit down at a table with that monger , I would have been hole carding as well .
In my opinion the casino hump exactly what they were doing and the card - bend charge was altogether fabricated to get the guys in more trouble . James and Mike were handcuffed and thrown in jailhouse . We receive a extremely publicized panel verdict on that face . But it got better . An organization know as the Griffin Detective Agency was employ by all the cassino in town to help oneself monitor APs and cheater . They release a large book with photos of these people on one Thomas Nelson Page and whatever they were guess to be doing on the confront Thomas Nelson Page . It said in the book that Mike was a card - carouse and that James associated with criminal . Neither of those allegation were true – and they contributed to the Caesars incident . We sued Griffin and received a six figure sum for defamation of character . The debt seemed to motivate Griffin to file bankruptcy .
At around the same time , James was just walking through a former casino called Imperial Palace . He was n’t even gambling . But force there were in the midst of investigating a team of advantage histrion that they thought James was a part of . The squad was hollow carding and signaling one another – two things that are completely effectual , by the elbow room . That fact that James was not even part of this team did n’t seem to intend much . He was spotted in the cassino , casino certificate people and agent from the Gaming Control Board pushed James against a wall , handcuff him , and admit him against his will . Through all of that , they could not key a crime that he had committed . I call back it was outrageous – and a jury check . He received $ 100,000 in compensatory harm and a verdict of $ 500,000 in punitive damages .
These pillowcase got a wad of public tending – James and Mike pause through wall that the casino industry had set up and they they care talking about it . Plus they were nearly involved in putting together their cases . They know so much about how the casino industry works and are so good at strategizing that they proved to be extremely helpful .
Though Grosjean got treated bad , one of the worst vilification of power that I ’ve see require a known vantage player – a guy who excelled at card - counting , sorting , sequencing , shuffle tracking – he was just the best in the world at everything . He got spot eating dinner in a casino . security system answer by having some guards hold him down on the base while others give up him repeatedly . He was internationally famous for legally winning lots of money from casinos , so the casino ’s goons drum the shit out of him . That stool no gumption , and it lead in a healthy but confidential settlement .
The fine art of suing the cops
It really arrive screwball out there . One display case I ’m work on now involves a stylist from New Jersey who was count circuit board at the Hard Rock , got backroomed , was imperil , handcuffed , and had his cellphone occupy away – all because he decline to show his ID while trying to cash in out some chips . Then there ’s the guy cable I represent who had been ace sequencing at blackjack – follow shuffling in a way that allow him to forecast when the very valuable aces will be come his way . He made a expectant wager , receive the sensation , and the casino decided to cancel the hand . That is completely nonsensical . But he remained reasonable . In the aftermath , all he wanted was to be paid what getting an one for your first card is worth – 50.4 % of your bet . But the casino would n’t give him that . Instead , when he return , hope to hold a copy of the surveillance footage , he wound up getting tackle and drag to the security office .
Sometimes you do n’t even have to gamble to find out yourself receiving undesirable attention . Casinos on a regular basis do sweeps for sporting lady . They look for attractive charwoman , well - coiffure and unescorted by men . My client was a very attractive topless dancer and a nursing student but not a prostitute .
She was in a Vegas gambling casino , security assumed she was hooking – never mind that she was waiting for her boyfriend to join her for a late dinner party – and pulled her into a back way with a act of supposed workings girls . They run her ID and she did not come up as somebody who had previously been squirt from a cassino . But surety decided that they still had likely cause to take her into custody . They did n’t have grounds . The judge agreed . I ca n’t give you the total amount of money that we got – the resolution is confidential – but I can secernate you that the Las Vegas constabulary give us in excess of $ 50,000 . That was immense . Any time you get more than 50 from the city , you have batter them . They nearly never have to pay . The law is stacked against anyone who sue the constabulary .
I ’ve line up that a turn of casinos do n’t like to devote either . gratefully they ’ve become less likely to beat the crap out of you , but they bump other ways to lawlessly restrain advantage players – and one direction is to not let you cash out your chip shot . belatedly one night I welcome a call from a woman we ’ll refer to as Mary Smith . She was being confronted by three casino security precaution and a police officer in Tunica , Mississippi . The casino refused to cash her fries and she was being accuse of cheating .
I got a cop on the earphone and said , “ What cheat ? I bed this someone . She is my guest . She does not rip off . ”
The cop told me she was card counting . I say , “ Sir , that is not cheating . ”
He asked me to hold on a minute of arc and began interfacing with the great unwashed from the gambling casino . They harmonize that card numeration is not illegal and the fuzz was severalize that he got called there because she refused to leave . I heard him say to the casino security measures guard , “ But she has $ 30,000 in chips ! Cash them out and then she will go away . ”
He left with his $ 70,000 and I got a snappy bridle : $ 10,000 for work from noon to 4:30 on a weekend twenty-four hours . It was nice and wanton .
So that got resolved easily enough . Other times it can be tricky . Late on a Saturday morning , a cat called to secernate me he was being held in detention . He was an reward instrumentalist who had a in particular wise , legal , way of winning casino lottery . He won $ 70,000 , filled out a W-2 with his correct social security system number but give a dissimilar name and designate an alias ID – a driver ’s license from Alabama . They said he gave a wrong name . But what ’s a name ? People call me Bob , but it does n’t say Bob on my ID . As for the ID he indicate them , in Nevada it ’s illegal to use a driver ’s license that does not have your nativity name on it . But the law here defines a driver ’s license as a papers write out by the Nevada Department of Motor Vehicles . What my guest usher is not a license emerge by the Nevada Department of Motor Vehicles . It is a piece of theme . It ’s nothing .
I did my good to excuse this to the police officer . He listened and disappeared for a few minutes . Then the guy come back , handed me my customer ’s Alabama gadget driver ’s licence and grudgingly say that my client should be allowed to receive his money . He left with his $ 70,000 and I got a natty stop : $ 10,000 for working from high noon to 4:30 on a weekend day . It was prissy and gentle .
A license to steal
Indian casino are tough . They ’re settle on sovereign state , and that pretty much gives them license to slip . For example , there was a team of advantage thespian in Arizona who withdraw vantage of a slot - simple machine packaging . By playing under certain condition on a slow day of the the workweek , they were able to realize a 2.7 % reward on the simple machine – all utterly legal and offered voluntarily by the cassino . It may not fathom like much , but the team was represent of several player and they were each putting through $ 500 per arcminute . So they were earning around $ 800 - per - hr each .
They play those machines as often as they could , they crushed them , and the cassino finally calculate out what was run short on . Officers from the DoS law , the sheriff ’s department , tribal police , and casino surety all put my clients into a backroom and interrogated them . My clients were honorable . They say that they beat the machines because of this advantageous promotion . But gambling casino security did n’t seem to care . They took whatever money my clients had in their pocket and pushed them out onto the street – and the cops helped . I pay back the money back , received a duet - hundred - thousand - dollars from the state and fix the matter with individual security officers . You have to remember that unlimited stealing occurred in this case ; they had no right hand to take my clients ’ money or to detain them .
People find out stories like this and they realize that I sour with a lot of very sharp risk taker . It unremarkably leads them to expect me about my own gambling habit . I enjoy craps a great deal , but I do n’t spiel it very often because I ’m too inexpensive . And here is the other thing : I bed the law of large numbers ; I love that I ca n’t beat the biz in the long run , and I do n’t like giving money off to casinos .
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